These are two very different definitions, but they are somehow presented as being equivalent.
4:39 PM
That is the core of the problem I have, which I would like to clarify and stop.
4:39 PM
I don't want people who are approaching the community to be misled, particularly when there are different methods for creating different specific brands of 'tulpa'.
If the claimed definition and actual usage of the word matched, I wouldn't be having this issue in discussion in the first place because the word would actually mean what it is claimed to mean.
The only ways to really solve the issue are to (1) adjust how we use the term and clearly and consistently use it as such or (2) adjust the presentation of the term.
When someone explains what their soulbond is, it often matches the definitions of a tulpa, it's just that they found the term soulbond first and usually the origin of the tulpa is more of a walk-in or at least based in existing characters rather than made from scratch.
(2) is easier, but secondary terms for the more specific types of tulpas would certainly need to be made in order for there to be some kind of actual consistency of discussion.
Perhaps to bolster morale, it seems we've always preferred the term "tulpa" from the get go, with qualifiers like "not yet sentient" or, if they show other signs of independence, "not yet vocal".(edited)
If they are using the term to equivocate their not-yet-vocal tulpa with, say... Harleen - or Luna.
4:44 PM
If they are using it as shorthand for "My idea of a tulpa that I am trying to get to be equivalent to developed tulpas", then I don't particularly care.
People who come into the community with something not-yet-sentient/vocal that wasn't deliberately started as following tulpamancy guides, is usually called "not a tulpa".
But, in things such as discussion of morality and generally how to treat tulpas or what tulpas are, I do take issue with people who have essentially imaginary friends with the appearance (to them) of independence equivocating that with tulpas that are well-developed and not one-dimensional characters.
However, very frequently we see people speak of their "tulpa"s that are not yet showing signs of sentience, but obviously the intent for development to be occurring is there.
We don't call other types of pluralities' thoughtforms tulpas by default, but we often allow people from other communities to consider their thoughtforms tulpas if they're in our community and seem to match our definitions of a tulpa.
Note that a lot of our discrepancies earlier were caused by you speaking from the standpoint of researching and explaining tulpas, while I was speaking on much more casual terms relevant to a single system's view of themselves, or a friend of theirs.
In somewhere like this, where the more... intellectually weighty (?) discussion occurs, I care quite a bit more about tulpas with regard to research/technical explanation.
4:50 PM
I think that perspective is highly valuable and can lead to more generally effective ways of making tulpas and helping people who are new.
I recently instated a mandatory wake-up time for the sake of lucid dreaming, but as recently as a week ago we were up all night as our schedule drifted.
I think a lot of the core properties that seem to be shared among tulpas do seem as discrepancies when compared to other thoughtforms. I can probably also see how the fundamental assumptions that a person has upon creation of a thoughtform (or development of a frontloaded-or-otherwise-induced spontaneous thoughtform phenomenon not unlike tulpa "walk-ins" into higher functioning separate personalities) would influence the qualities of their existence in ways that are hard to notice due to the difficulty of truly taking notice of things that have started this way.
Thank you for making that correction. MPD is a controversial and strange story of diagnostic rushes that happen after the idea is spread to the greater public.
8:03 PM
"Disorder" always implies that it causes distress or malfunction in a person's normal path of living. It isn't a disorder unless it causes something to be bad in your life.
@𝐂𝐨𝐳𝐦𝐨_ 🐠⋆｡𖦹°🪼 What you call split personality disorder is Dissociative Identity Disorder, which is a form of plurality. "Plurality" describes any instance of more than one person/consciousness/identity sharing a brain. Tulpas are also a form of plurality, but not quite the same as DID. DID is defined by dysfunction, while creating a tulpa generally does not cause dysfunction or anything that could be classified as a mental disorder
If making a tulpa leads to a bad thing in your life, I would normally think the real problem goes very much further deep than the simple act of making a tulpa. I do not think it is irreversible though, I think people can definitely reverse it in theory if a person is good at manipulating their habits and beliefs and thoughts.
8:08 PM
But again, a tulpa in my understanding represents personality changes in the range of your brain's ability to express it. In this sense, a tulpa "problem" feels more like a personality issue if it's really an issue caused by creating a tulpa. Personality problems are just flaws, and they can be corrected with the right motivation and will to improve one's self. Otherwise, it is a problem that was present before creation of a tulpa, and it may be the act of making a tulpa has made it become more visible.
Three of the five criteria for having DID are as follows:
Must not be related to cultural practices - tulpamancy is of course a cultural practice
Amnesia must occur
The alters/identities must bring dysfunction/distress to your life
This rules out tulpas as being considered DID(edited)
Well you know. I am pretty sure the culture part was removed from the ICD-11. Amnesia isn't mandatory(particularly if you go partial-DID) and distress can happen in say professional or private life because... well being multiple.(edited)
True. I am just pointing out by the language technically tulpas can fall under the DID description because the whole trauma origin isn't actually explicitly mentioned.
8:45 PM
Also there are some very distressed people who made tulpas. Though how often it can be linked to the actual tulpamancy is in question.
“if someone wants to go into tulpamancy thinking their tulpa should just be a side character in their life and not actually live their own fulfilling life, they should be heavily dissuaded from making tulpas”
Good thought, Piano
I guess the ethics of it all depend on how far you want to go with your tulpa. If you plan to develop them to an advanced level, keeping them from possession and switching is surely cruel. If you only want to go as far as a Spontaneous Imaginary Friend, then it’s fine.
The thing with tulpas is they’re not categorical. It’s not “imaginary friend” or “full blown tulpa.” There are spaces in between where different ethics apply.
About the “fulfilling lives” point, I’d say that it’s fine because Spontaneous Imaginary Friends don’t truly want anything. They’re not capable of that, so it’s alright to limit them.
In general, as I’ve said before, the one reason behind making a tulpa that I can really agree with is the desire to “love and be loved.” Any other reasoning can probably be fulfilled in more effective ways. Or the reasonings could be a result of psychological distress that needs to be resolved rather than painted over with a new tulpa.
9:33 PM
At the same time, @Lillyshins, I’d argue that tulpas can actually be really helpful for stabilising your mental state. I know Cilsc certainly did for me in the beginning. That is, before I freaked out a bit about having some voice in my head. I also didn’t know that tulpas were a thing.
this just popped into my head while forcing can become "immune" to different techniques because it always seems stuff works well for a while and then falls off in effectiveness, I know it could just be me being excited to try something new but it seems constant
You may find a benefit in being more process oriented, rather than goal oriented.
1:49 AM
Using methods you wholeheartedly believe in consistently should inevitably bring results. In my opinion, constantly focusing on some arbitrary measure of progress will lead to disappointment at best, and hinder progress at worst.
1:49 AM
I find that's applicable to most areas of life, but someone can correct me if this doesn't really apply to Tulpamancy.
I don't think I'm trying to be too advanced just trying to get a reliable mind voice going maybe visualization
1:58 AM
it probably is me just having something work decent the first time and then when I try it again or the next time I don't as good a result so I lose interest but it feels like more than that either way I need to get back to forcing
@Blitzeen sorry never ended up getting back on yesterday. At the very least mine are seeming to take my mental stability extremely seriously this time and are doing really everything they can to make it easy on me.
Sorry if this interrupts any conversation right now I just wanted to respond because I forgot to yesterday.
So are there words commenly used to describe people with multiple personalities that isnt assiociated with DID? Multiple personalities just brings up did and i cant think of anything else.
Im kind of looking for an umbrella term for tulpas and author created personalities and stuff like that. Just for research and stuff...
8:25 AM
The craze surrounding DID is making this really hard
8:31 AM
Also why are tulpas not associated with the author thing? It seems like they are both extremely similar
[Hi guys, I have thought on and off about writing a guide about Tulpamancy and anxiety. I want to write out the guide in a Q and A format and provide some ideas/solutions for anyone who is stressed out about something Tulpa-related and clean up some misconceptions about anxiety and Tulpamancy. Would anyone find a guide like that useful?]
[I want to write a working draft of it first, and then I'll throw it in here for feedback. I am using my personal experiences and things I have heard for large parts of the guide, so I want to make sure they are valid and make sense. I would also like to add any other experiences/advice other people had.]
